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Old 04-04-2001, 04:02 PM   #1
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Question Premarital Sex and many other religious concerns

I am dating this guy who is extremely Christian. Believes the bible word for word. Goes to church. Will not have sex cause he thinks it is a sin before marriage nor will he kiss his girlfriends or anything until marriage. He seems to be very unhappy and tormented. Always thinking he is a bad person and going to hell. I would like to know why Christians believe that Premarital Sex is Bad. I would like to know if it even says that in the bible. How can anyone know if the bible is correct cause man wrote it? And if Adam and Eve are recorded from 5000 years ago and we have fossils of people from millions of years old then who wrote the first entry for Adam and Eve if they were the only two people? And can I still believe in God and Christ but not the bible. Does anyone know anything about any of this. If so I would appreciate a response either here or email. Belladoll2@aol.com is my email. Thanks so much. I would appreciate all comments
 
Old 04-04-2001, 04:20 PM   #2
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Quote:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by bella:
I am dating this guy who is extremely Christian. Believes the bible word for word. Goes to church. Will not have sex cause he thinks it is a sin before marriage nor will he kiss his girlfriends or anything until marriage. He seems to be very unhappy and tormented.</font>
Sounds like quite the catch.

Quote:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Always thinking he is a bad person and going to hell.</font>
Gotta love it!

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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">I would like to know why Christians believe that Premarital Sex is Bad.</font>
I have no idea. Premarital sex is good. Would you buy a pair of shoes without trying them on?

Quote:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">I would like to know if it even says that in the bible.</font>
It does if you want it to.

Quote:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">How can anyone know if the bible is correct cause man wrote it? And if Adam and Eve are recorded from 5000 years ago and we have fossils of people from millions of years old then who wrote the first entry for Adam and Eve if they were the only two people?</font>
Boing!! Nice one.

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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">And can I still believe in God and Christ but not the bible.</font>
That would be problematic, since the buybull is the only place Jesus appears. Did Jesus ever have premarital sex though: that's what I want to know.
 
Old 04-04-2001, 04:26 PM   #3
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One favorite speculation is that Mary Magdalene had been Jesus Christ's girlfriend, and that the two had gotten it on; in www.salon.com its section on sex, there was a fantasy of MM and JC getting it on, told from MM's point of view.

There is nothing to support this in the canonical Gospels, but the noncanonical Gospel of Philip states that JC had kissed MM on the mouth and that his other followers asked why JC loved MM more than them.

Also, JC has an unnamed "beloved disciple" in the Gospel of John -- could this disciple have been MM?
 
Old 04-04-2001, 04:36 PM   #4
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The Bible is far from one voice in regard to sex.

In the Old Testament, a man has considerable sexual freedom; only other men and other men's wives are off-limits. Some men even had several wives; Bill Clinton might seem normal by OT standards

Women are much more restricted; they may get stoned to death if they are discovered to be non-virgin when they marry.

The New Testament is the opposite, with practicing no sex at all being the ideal and with marital sex being tolerated only as a lesser evil. Not surprisingly, Jesus Christ claims that one ought to cut off body parts that lead one astray, and even states that there are eunuchs who have made themselves eunuchs for the sake of the Kingdom of Heaven (Matthew 19:12). As if sexuality is something that one must get rid of.

 
Old 04-04-2001, 04:38 PM   #5
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bella:
And can I still believe in God and Christ but not the bible.

lp:
What do you wish to believe about them?
 
Old 04-06-2001, 06:08 AM   #6
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bella:
Your boyfriend doesn't have much to worry about. It's ok for men to have sex with many women (except with women who are the property of other men).

[The law of Moses says that non-virgin brides are to be stoned to death (Deut 22:20). But the penalty for a man to rape an unengaged girl is for the man to pay the bride price of 50 pieces of silver, and be married to her and never be divorced. (Deut 22:28-29)]

Some Bible stories:
(Note: a concubine is a "mistress")
Genesis 16:1-4 - Sarai is the first of a long line of barren women who were desperate for children. (In the Bible, it is the women who are barren, never the men.) She sends Abram into her handmaid, Hagar, so that she can "obtain children by her." Abram gladly complies.

Genesis 19:8 - Lot refuses to give up his angels to the perverted mob, offering his two "virgin daughters" instead. He tells the bunch of angel rapers to "do unto them [his daughters] as is good in your eyes." This is the same man that is called "just" and "righteous" in 2 Pet.2:7-8.

Genesis 19:30-38 - Lot and his daughters camp out in a cave for a while. The daughters get their "just and righteous" father drunk, and have sexual intercourse with him, and each conceives and bears a son (wouldn't you know it!). Just another wholesome family values Bible story.

Genesis 29:21-30 - Jacob is tricked by Laban, the father of Rachel and Leah. Jacob asks for Rachel so that he can "go in unto her." But Laban gives him Leah instead, and Jacob "went in unto her [Leah]" by mistake. Jacob was fooled until morning -- apparently he didn't know who he was going in unto. Finally they worked things out and Jacob got to "go in unto" Rachel, too.

Genesis 30:1-4 - "Give me children or else I die." Rachel considers herself worthless if she cannot produce children for her husband. But luckily she has an idea. She says to Jacob, "Behold my maid Bilhah, go in unto her." She solved the problem the same way as did Sarah (16:2). "And Jacob went in unto her. And Bilhah coneived, and bare Jacob a son." (These arrangements never seem to produce daughters.)

Genesis 35:22 - "Reuben went and lay with his father's concubine." I wonder why God wants to tell us about it. Maybe he figures that "inquiring minds want to know."

2 Sam.11:2-4 - David watches a [married] women bathe, likes what he sees, and "goes in unto her."

But those people are usually punished or look down upon in some way.
Anyway your boyfriend seems to be going by the N.T. There's a verse in it where Jesus says that if you look at a woman and want to possess her (have sex with her?) then you are guilty of committing adultery. (And if you hate your brother, you're committing murder)
So I think your boyfriend is trying to make sure he doesn't have any desire to have sex with girls at the moment by avoiding even kissing them.
 
Old 04-06-2001, 06:15 AM   #7
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Maybe you could use your relationship as a way of influencing him towards the dark side of putting our happiness on earth first. His church probably taught him to put up a shield though.... maybe you could find verses in the Bible that say that Christians are filled with the joy of the Holy Spirit. (Pretend that you're on his side) He might be encouraged a bit, but sooner or later he'll give up. Basically become more fundamentalist than he is. I bet he doesn't even follow the entire commandment about observing the Sabbath (Friday 6pm to Saturday 6pm). During that period, no one is supposed to work - or even light a flame, etc.
 
Old 04-06-2001, 10:08 AM   #8
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Bella,

First of all congratulations. A questioning mind is an open mind.

Second, I would strongly suggest that you not give out your email address on this or any bulletin board. There are a lot of nutcakes in cyber space.
 
Old 04-06-2001, 10:19 AM   #9
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I read somewhere about sexuality and Christianity, and I can't give references (sorry), but it was interesting, if true.

Most of the rules about premarital sex in the Bible are actually derived from the concept of women as chattel. A virgin daughter is a valuable commodity, and premarital sex obviously devalues that commodity. Thus, the sin isn't the sexual act, but rather effectively stealing something from the woman's owner, their father.

However, what you believe is up to you. In my opinion, discarding the Bible leaves little room for Jesus, but it's your decision.
 
Old 04-06-2001, 02:41 PM   #10
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Matthew 09:20 And, behold, a woman, which was diseased with an
issue of blood twelve years, came behind him,
and touched the hem of his garment:
Matthew 09:21 For she said within herself, If I may but
touch his garment, I shall be whole.
Matthew 09:22 But Jesus turned him about, and when he saw
her, he said, Daughter, be of good comfort;
thy faith hath made thee whole. And the woman
was made whole from that hour.

Hmm, a girl starts her period at about 14 years old ... maybe this
lady was about 26 years old? How do you stop a period?

Jubilees 33:04 And he lay with her. And she woke up and looked,
and behold, Reuben was lying with her on the bed.
And she uncovered the hem of her
(skirt) and seized him and screamed and
recognized that it was Reuben.

Hem and sex? I wonder how many times the word him can be found in the
gospels?

Also;
Jubilees 33:08 And Jacob was very angry with Reuben because
he had lain with Bilhah, for he had uncovered his
father's robe.

It is not a very good idea to uncover your dad's Robe.
Just ask Noah.

What about virgin? Can you find me a virgin in the Bible who
is not a Hebrew lady?

Nope, you cannot. Only Hebrew girls a virgins.

thanks, offa


 
 

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